What a tantalizing question! Okay, while I've tried to stop buying books (at age 90), I've ordered this one on the Nones. I probably won't be ready to post anything until I've read that book. But at the same time this lies right next to a host of other social changes over the last quarter-century. The Nones sit parallel to the major changes in attitudes toward marriage (now with a majority seeing shacking up a wiser choice) (see my 2004 book Marriage Made in Eden). Once any kind of question about the validity of a stricture is entertained, that willingness to consider an alternative punches a hole in the "invincible" religious wall constructed to protect a belief structure. It's all those rocks rolling down the hill and striking the sides of the paradigm until eventually the paradigm is tattered.
I have to comment on the statement, "devout Protestant Christians are Republicans, with very few exceptions.” As a Black Christian, it surprises me to see this statement which is true of white Christians but decidedly false among Black. Increasingly, I believe Black Christians are invisible to the white world. Black Christians are leaving white Evangelical spaces but not necessarily the church as in the #LeaveLoud movement. Perhaps our invisibility to the Evangelical church is part of the problem.
Thanks Norman, and Ryan Burge is not to blame. I'm just summarizing but in his chp and book he is always alert to how polls are taken and where Black Protestants fit. It is increasingly obvious to social scientists that Black Protestants may have similar "beliefs" but they are not evangelicals (in the same way). One of the most important conclusions of this book, stated in this summary, is that politics is more determinative for church choice than theology! Which is precisely what you are saying: to the degree this statement is true of the GOP evangelicals, to the same degree their politics exclude blacks! Very sad to say, but I believe this is true and accurate and shameful.
The research on the Dones I referred to crossed all racial and denominational boundaries ... It's not just Black Christians who are invisible in White Evangelical spaces. Anyone who doesn't fit their model is invisible to them. Such astounding blindness ... Lord have mercy 😔🙏
This is a great point, Norman. I do try to be explicit when I talk about things like this: white evangelicalism is overwhelmingly Republican. Black Protestants are overwhelmingly Democratic. Hispanics are harder to quantify though. The Hispanic Protestant vote was split right down the middle in 2020, while Hispanic Catholics were 2/3 for Biden.
Interesting. I wonder if Josh Packard, who researched the Dones, has seen this? Being Done myself, with 3 sons who are not married and don't have children, my eldest is also Done and the younger 2 are Nones -- so I have been living this up close and personal.
I see this as a commentary on the religious institution's focus on outward moral control to the detriment of true attachment (emotional, spiritual, and intellectual) to God as adopted children. Nones are done with the hypocrisy of moral judgment from conservative Christianity.
Until they meet the real Jesus and begin to experience the life Jesus lives in Father with the Spirit... they'll continue to be Nones, because the Jesus of the institutions -- whether conservative or liberal -- is more of a political motivational scheme than the personal and relational God-Man-brother who shows us what Father is really like. Family trumps institution every time...in the opinion of your wee Purple Abbess, that is.
I'm wondering if Burge was able to take into account the Trump factor related to this topic. Some people believe Trump has had an extremely negative effect on Christianity.
Burge works with the most important data banks of information so, yes, if such bits were available. There has been a steady increase of Nones and I'd have to study the graphs to see if there are any jumps following 2014, but I don't recall any. The book by Whitehead and Perry on Christian Nationalism works with the conclusions of a rather steady increase of Nones (unaffiliated) and also a rather noticeable shift away from Christian nationalism. these studies will help all of us.
Hi Ruth- I think it's hard to isolate the Trump effect specifically because I only really had one pull of the GSS data (from 2018) for the book. The 2016 survey was before the election and the 2020 hadn't released yet. But, I think Trump just unearthed that reality that white Christianity had basically purged all the moderates and liberals over the last four decades. In the 1970s, 50% of white weekly church goers were Democrats and 35% were Republicans. Today, it's 50% Republicans and 25% Democrats. Seeking political purity surely has hurt the church.
What a tantalizing question! Okay, while I've tried to stop buying books (at age 90), I've ordered this one on the Nones. I probably won't be ready to post anything until I've read that book. But at the same time this lies right next to a host of other social changes over the last quarter-century. The Nones sit parallel to the major changes in attitudes toward marriage (now with a majority seeing shacking up a wiser choice) (see my 2004 book Marriage Made in Eden). Once any kind of question about the validity of a stricture is entertained, that willingness to consider an alternative punches a hole in the "invincible" religious wall constructed to protect a belief structure. It's all those rocks rolling down the hill and striking the sides of the paradigm until eventually the paradigm is tattered.
I hope I'm reading and buying books at 90, Alice.
I love you Alice, and I love that you continue to buy books at age 90.
I have to comment on the statement, "devout Protestant Christians are Republicans, with very few exceptions.” As a Black Christian, it surprises me to see this statement which is true of white Christians but decidedly false among Black. Increasingly, I believe Black Christians are invisible to the white world. Black Christians are leaving white Evangelical spaces but not necessarily the church as in the #LeaveLoud movement. Perhaps our invisibility to the Evangelical church is part of the problem.
Thanks Norman, and Ryan Burge is not to blame. I'm just summarizing but in his chp and book he is always alert to how polls are taken and where Black Protestants fit. It is increasingly obvious to social scientists that Black Protestants may have similar "beliefs" but they are not evangelicals (in the same way). One of the most important conclusions of this book, stated in this summary, is that politics is more determinative for church choice than theology! Which is precisely what you are saying: to the degree this statement is true of the GOP evangelicals, to the same degree their politics exclude blacks! Very sad to say, but I believe this is true and accurate and shameful.
The research on the Dones I referred to crossed all racial and denominational boundaries ... It's not just Black Christians who are invisible in White Evangelical spaces. Anyone who doesn't fit their model is invisible to them. Such astounding blindness ... Lord have mercy 😔🙏
This is a great point, Norman. I do try to be explicit when I talk about things like this: white evangelicalism is overwhelmingly Republican. Black Protestants are overwhelmingly Democratic. Hispanics are harder to quantify though. The Hispanic Protestant vote was split right down the middle in 2020, while Hispanic Catholics were 2/3 for Biden.
Interesting. I wonder if Josh Packard, who researched the Dones, has seen this? Being Done myself, with 3 sons who are not married and don't have children, my eldest is also Done and the younger 2 are Nones -- so I have been living this up close and personal.
I see this as a commentary on the religious institution's focus on outward moral control to the detriment of true attachment (emotional, spiritual, and intellectual) to God as adopted children. Nones are done with the hypocrisy of moral judgment from conservative Christianity.
Until they meet the real Jesus and begin to experience the life Jesus lives in Father with the Spirit... they'll continue to be Nones, because the Jesus of the institutions -- whether conservative or liberal -- is more of a political motivational scheme than the personal and relational God-Man-brother who shows us what Father is really like. Family trumps institution every time...in the opinion of your wee Purple Abbess, that is.
Lord have mercy 😔🙏
I actually did a Instagram live with Josh yesterday! I love what he's doing with Springtide.
I just downloaded his report and am looking forward to going through it.
I'm wondering if Burge was able to take into account the Trump factor related to this topic. Some people believe Trump has had an extremely negative effect on Christianity.
Burge works with the most important data banks of information so, yes, if such bits were available. There has been a steady increase of Nones and I'd have to study the graphs to see if there are any jumps following 2014, but I don't recall any. The book by Whitehead and Perry on Christian Nationalism works with the conclusions of a rather steady increase of Nones (unaffiliated) and also a rather noticeable shift away from Christian nationalism. these studies will help all of us.
Hi Ruth- I think it's hard to isolate the Trump effect specifically because I only really had one pull of the GSS data (from 2018) for the book. The 2016 survey was before the election and the 2020 hadn't released yet. But, I think Trump just unearthed that reality that white Christianity had basically purged all the moderates and liberals over the last four decades. In the 1970s, 50% of white weekly church goers were Democrats and 35% were Republicans. Today, it's 50% Republicans and 25% Democrats. Seeking political purity surely has hurt the church.
Secularism, politics, internet. Seems to me the church can only hope to change its position on one of these things...